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Thread: A123 Systems, radical new Lithium Ion technology

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  1.  
    #51
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    Yeah if they put these things in cordless drills they can't be THAT expensive can they?? Hehehe.

    The 15 minute charging would be very convenient, and would offset the "low" capacity that I mentioned. I need to see prices though. I like your idea of 60 bucks for a 2s pack!
     

  2.  
    #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Pede
    Yeah if they put these things in cordless drills they can't be THAT expensive can they?? Hehehe.

    The 15 minute charging would be very convenient, and would offset the "low" capacity that I mentioned. I need to see prices though. I like your idea of 60 bucks for a 2s pack!
    Their developer kits straight from their site are about 120 I think, which is six of these cells. 120/6=20 bucks per cell. A 2s2p has 4 cells total, include the deans and balancer connectors and assembly, and you're maybe looking at 85-90 bucks just based off those numbers (of course, that's direct from them...not a distributor who buys in bulk and gets mucho dinero off). I've seen some dewalt 10 cell packs go for about 130-150, which still ain't too shabby as far as dollahz per cell go.

    60 bucks max would be preferable though....::cough::listening A123?::cough::

    I could totally get used to a 5 minute charge for 90% capacity, or 15 minute charges for 100% too.... The magic box just makes the deal sweeter.
     

  3.  
    #53
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    Their web site still has no info about all this...

    Matt - do you have any read on when this thing will be ready to ship? Are we talking this year or next?

    DM
     

  4.  
    #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacII
    Their web site still has no info about all this...

    Matt - do you have any read on when this thing will be ready to ship? Are we talking this year or next?

    DM
    I asked the same question. To our surprise, A123 said a couple of weeks, but I imagine they'll be in the users hands in about a month or so.
     

  5.  
    #55
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    Wow! That is surprising...Great news.

    Did they give you any idea on cost? Some of the prices mentioned in this thread don't seem too realistic for cutting edge new technology - at least not at the beginning of it's life cycle. Are we talking $250-$400 for a complete setup (Pack, Charger, Magic Box)?
     

  6.  
    #56
    A couple of ideas:
    1. If they made nimh cells flatter and wider like the lipo cells, they would be able to get more capacity and voltage in them.
    2. As far as we know the 'turbo box' could be slightly larger than a transponder. The pictures are big so we can see what the stuff looks like. On the chart it could boost a 3s pack to 14.4v (E-maxx here I come).
    3. They say they can make different configurations, what if the turbo could enhance and number of cells by 1.5 (turn a 5s into 6s+ voltage.)
    4. If the turbo boost function could be activated by a third channel that would be great for so many reasons (electric nitrous being the biggest one!)

    Just my .04!

    A 6000 7.4V (2S2P, from MaxAmps) is:
    44mm X 137mm X 22mm
    A 4600 6.6V (2S2P from page 1) is:
    55mm X 135mm X 28mm
    Last edited by electro21; 07-17-2006 at 09:48 AM. Reason: battery dimensions
     

  7.  
    #57
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    06-26-2005
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    This definatly seems like somthing worth investing it.
     

  8.  
    #58
    These look absolutely awesome, though there's not much I can say that hasn't already been said.

    If the turbo boost function could be activated by a third channel that would be great for so many reasons (electric nitrous being the biggest one!)
    I *really* like that idea too!
     

  9.  
    #59
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    As far as we know the 'turbo box' could be slightly larger than a transponder. The pictures are big so we can see what the stuff looks like.
    Can't we get a decent idea of the size of the boost box (and other components) by looking at the Deans plugs connected to them?
     

  10.  
    #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Pede
    Can't we get a decent idea of the size of the boost box (and other components) by looking at the Deans plugs connected to them?
    Check out the dimensions of the boost box. It's a 10mm tall 51mm square, so a little larger width wise than a Sub C shotgun pack, and about the thickness of a Novak 5v fan.
     

  11.  
    #61
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    Cool now what about prices??? Who knows if I'll ever get this stuff, but I'm as curious as anyone. Can't wait to see what this will cost.
     

  12.  
    #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Pede
    Cool now what about prices??? Who knows if I'll ever get this stuff, but I'm as curious as anyone. Can't wait to see what this will cost.
    I emailed A123 about that, so we'll see if I get a reply back. Maybe Matt has more of an inside scoop, or Peter.
     

  13.  
    #63
    sounds good, cant wait for a price. i used to get ni-cds out of drills years ago, maybe its time to check out some new ones!
     

  14.  
    #64
    Quote Originally Posted by electro21
    A couple of ideas:
    1. If they made nimh cells flatter and wider like the lipo cells, they would be able to get more capacity and voltage in them.
    Even if there was an improvement, it still wouldn't stack up to li-po let alone a123 batteries with their longer life cycle.

    I find nimh racing batteries to be a rip off. Too much money for something that goes slower, loses it's edge too fast (lifespan), and doesn't offer near the run time for the weight as li-po and these new li-ion batteries.

    I think it's time for brushed motors (and trinity for that matter) and nimh batteries to be sent to the rc graveyard.
     

  15.  
    #65
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    05-28-2006
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    WOw, I am just now reading this for the first time, I read every post and well if its everything it says to be WOW. I am not sure about the extra weight of a box on the truck to get the voltage you need but, maybe it wont be to bad maybe the Batterys themselves weigh less enough to just about even out the weight of a 7 cell pack now with nicad or nekile metal.

    I cant wait to see prices and more info on this.I fly lipo in my airplanes and run Niklemetal in my cars, and who was talking about love to get more time with a E truck then a Nitro, Id ont knwo what you got but I get like 12 minutes with my Electric trucks and the most I can get out of my nitro rustler with a small 2.5 is 10 minutes. so I enjoy Electric more I just hope the speed will catch up for less money soon.
     

  16.  
    #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-PoweredRc
    WOw, I am just now reading this for the first time, I read every post and well if its everything it says to be WOW. I am not sure about the extra weight of a box on the truck to get the voltage you need but, maybe it wont be to bad maybe the Batterys themselves weigh less enough to just about even out the weight of a 7 cell pack now with nicad or nekile metal.
    From some rough estimates, a 2s2p of A123 cells is about 3 oz. lighter than a 6 cell stick pack of GP4300s.

    345g (~12.1 oz.) for the A123 2s2p AND magic box

    430g (~15.3 oz.) for a GP4300 stick pack
    Last edited by ElectricThunder; 07-18-2006 at 06:13 PM.
     

  17.  
    #67
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    01-27-2005
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    I thought I posted 6 months ago that a123 was coming out with new cells?
     

  18. a123racing is now on line 
    #68
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    07-19-2006
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    at 0600 est [7-19] www.a123racing.com came on line, not all the links were working properly but hey, it's up...

    Ron
     

  19.  
    #69
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    Checked out the website. Pretty good prices! Definatly reasonable. This could very well be the turning point is racing battery tech.
     

  20.  
    #70
    Quote Originally Posted by trailranger
    I thought I posted 6 months ago that a123 was coming out with new cells?
    Yes, the new cells are old news now. The big deal with this thread is the fact that the new cells are being packaged and marketed for r/c vehicles for the first time.
     

  21.  
    #71
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    Prices aren't too shabby. 99 bucks for a 2s2p 4600 is nice. 140 for the 2s2p with "magic box". I think I shall ask Santa for this stuff (or just buy it myself).....
     

  22.  
    #72
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    CHA.....CHING!!!

    Good prices!!! Relatively speaking anyways. No LVC required...very quick charging...same light weight and power of other lithiums, plus greater discharge rates...less risk of fire...not too shabby!!!

    I guess the turbo box is basically required if you want to have the power in your vehicles that you're used to (in my case 7.2V). Looks like the charger is $80. So that's...$220 for 4600 pack, boost box, and charger. The "starter kit bundles" link isn't working yet for me. I wonder how much of a price advantage there will be if you get all 3 components in a bundle?

    I'm curious about how the charger and turbo box are adjusted??? I can't see any buttons or switches or anything on either piece of equipment. Does the charger automatically charge every pack in 15 minutes, or do you get to decide? It says max. charge rate is 10.5 amps. Is that adjustable?

    I assume the boost box just has some switch to select 7.2v, 10.8v, etc. One interesting thing, the site says the balancing plug on the packs (which again I can't see in the pictures) is an Anderson connector...isn't that the same as Powerpoles? I wonder if I could get Powerpoles as the main plug on the pack and charger?

    I don't expect anyone to have answers to all my questions, I'm just venting.

    EDIT: Actually, I can see the balancing plug on the packs in the pictures. Hard to tell the exact shape though.
     

  23.  
    #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Pede
    CHA.....CHING!!!

    Good prices!!! Relatively speaking anyways. No LVC required...very quick charging...same light weight and power of other lithiums, plus greater discharge rates...less risk of fire...not too shabby!!!

    I guess the turbo box is basically required if you want to have the power in your vehicles that you're used to (in my case 7.2V). Looks like the charger is $80. So that's...$220 for 4600 pack, boost box, and charger. The "starter kit bundles" link isn't working yet for me. I wonder how much of a price advantage there will be if you get all 3 components in a bundle?

    I'm curious about how the charger and turbo box are adjusted??? I can't see any buttons or switches or anything on either piece of equipment. Does the charger automatically charge every pack in 15 minutes, or do you get to decide? It says max. charge rate is 10.5 amps. Is that adjustable?

    I assume the boost box just has some switch to select 7.2v, 10.8v, etc. One interesting thing, the site says the balancing plug on the packs (which again I can't see in the pictures) is an Anderson connector...isn't that the same as Powerpoles? I wonder if I could get Powerpoles as the main plug on the pack and charger?

    I don't expect anyone to have answers to all my questions, I'm just venting.
    I'm not sure about the charger, but I do know the "magic box" adjusts its voltage via a pushbutton (I guess like most one touch setup ESCs). It probably cycles through the 4 settings like how you would cycle through throttle profiles on an ESC.

    When they say anderson connectors, I think they're talking a different kind, not power pole andersons, but maybe something similar to a Rx plug or molex kind of connector or something. I'm sure you could switch out the deans for powerpoles, however, something to note, is the 69 cont. and 138 surge amps for the 4600 are "limited by connectors". So if you use something like 75 amp power poles...who knows what'll happen. You may void a warranty, but who knows.
     

  24.  
    #74
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    Glad the web site is up...prices look great considering what they are saying all this will do. Now it's a matter of seeing this stuff in real world conditions and making sure it's truly "RC Grade" as I like to call it. Still no info about how much capacity you loose by dialing up the voltage from 6.6v to 7.2v+...

    Regarding the charger, I suspect it is likely a "smart" charge where it adjust the charge rate depending on where it is in the charge cycle. No need for user interaction.

    Also no mention of ship dates. I tried to order one but was greeted with a page saying ordering was for testing only earlier today...now it looks like orders can be processed.

    I've emailed them a Question about running two in series (for my Electric Monster) I can't think of a reason it wouldn't work but I wanted to check. Also asked about capacity loss when using the Magic Box.
     

  25.  
    #75
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    Hmmmmm. Well if Powerpoles are fine for my relatively low-powered setup with GP3300's, I assume they'll be OK with the same motor but a nicer battery pack. I think they're the 35 amp ones, the standard ones. With an SS5800-powered Stampede, I really won't be approaching the max. output of this pack.
     

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